anyone with legal experience?

Discussion in 'Public General Chat' started by hexedprojekt, Dec 20, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. hexedprojekt
    Guest

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2008
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    0
    Occupation:
    Po Po Academy
    Location:
    Newyork
    am having a rather annoying issue, about 5-6 months ago i sold my WoW account to a company that buys accounts, recently i have recieved e-mails and jsut had a long conversation with one of their employees who has accused or as he puts it i am guitly of Account fraud. Apparantly the account i sold them had the e-mail and password reset by someone calling it in, and it was reset to my password. i have no logon on to wow or even have had the disc installed since i sold the account, and now they are trying to possibly take legal actions in had. I find this to be complete bullshit since i haven't done anything accused off but they say they have accurate evidence including a phone number by who it was reset by but refuses to give me the number or any other helpful information. they do say i can return the money or account but i feel like if i do it cud happen again or so they say? i have asked numerous times for evidence only to say i can only see in legal discovery? how the fuck am i susposed to know if it was a hack, or a friend or it was them if they refuse to give out information i believe i was hacked but iono this just pisses me off way to much anyone have advice?


    Apologize for the block of Text :/
     
  2. Meemo
    Guest

    I'm no lawyer, but here are my thoughts:

    Isn't this against the WoW EULA ?
    Although that doesn't make it illegal, it means that they can't rely on the accounts working after being purchased.

    Meaning they are probably trying to scam you. Ignore them unless they actually file a lawsuit, since I doubt that they will. Then fight it.

    Threatening to send copies of everything you receive to Blizzard could also make them back down, given that Blizzard will want to ban any accounts that company has got hold of and thus ruin its business.

    Unless they actually give you this evidence, accuse them of lying at any point they bring it up.

    Reply telling them that you don't believe them. After all, you would also have the same evidence and them revealing it would make you cooperate with them quicker.
     
  3. Lev
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    1,577
    Likes Received:
    5
    Occupation:
    Dancer
    Location:
    Vancouver BC
    Please remember that XoO in entirety supports and abides by the EULA and NDA of every game that is in the supported, beta or alpha divisions and that it does not condone account selling.
     
  4. Panacea
    Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2008
    Messages:
    816
    Likes Received:
    2
    Occupation:
    Marketing Assistant
    Location:
    London, United Kingdom
    Account buying and selling is against the EULA and they broke that by buying an account, therefore any legal action taken in regards to said account is void.
     
  5. Meemo
    Guest

    On the other hand, scammers like this deserve to be hit hard.

    Forget about threatening to send the correspondence to Blizzard. Just send it and tell them that you have done so.

    Yes, it will probably cause any other WoW accounts you have to be banned if you have any. But you broke the EULA, so you deserve that.
     
  6. doctorie
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2008
    Messages:
    4,490
    Likes Received:
    5
    Occupation:
    volunteer worker for alchoholics anon
    Location:
    Wellington, New Zealand
    edit..no legal experience. I sense a scam tho
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2008
  7. Tribat
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2008
    Messages:
    366
    Likes Received:
    11
    Occupation:
    Geek Squad Supervisor (Best Buy)
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    Watch out for the EULA police.

    But srsly, tell them to fuck off and just ignore them until they sue you and then your defense is that it was an illegal transaction in the first place so they have no claim to anything. Chances are that even if they aren't scamming you (which they are), they are based in China or the like and don't have the means to sue you in an American court. BTW if they have any credit card info or anything like that, you should call your cc company and tell them your card was lost or stolen and get a new cc #.
     
  8. Lev
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    1,577
    Likes Received:
    5
    Occupation:
    Dancer
    Location:
    Vancouver BC
    Love you too Tribat =]
     
  9. mercsan
    Veteran Crowfall Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    1,461
    Likes Received:
    0
    Happened to me.

    Politely call blizzard and tell them your account was hacked and you no longer use it. Blizzard will have proof of this by the last time you activated your account with a CC that they should have on file from your last activation.

    The company on the other hand. Tell them to EAD.

    i.e. Buying a gun without a license is illegal.. Stealing the gun without a license is illegal. they are GG'd either way.
     
  10. You're not telling us the truth. Once you do, I will give you some advice.
     
  11. Secksy
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2008
    Messages:
    2,985
    Likes Received:
    9
    Location:
    Texas
    How the hell did we go from this

    To this

    ???
     
  12. Lev
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    1,577
    Likes Received:
    5
    Occupation:
    Dancer
    Location:
    Vancouver BC
    Trolling?
     
  13. Kyoji
    Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2008
    Messages:
    10,194
    Likes Received:
    182
    Location:
    Indiana, U.S.
    or perhaps he knows something we don't.
     
  14. Meemo
    Guest

    How about you fill us in on the parts that hexedprojekt is lying about ?
     
  15. The Cox
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2008
    Messages:
    5,898
    Likes Received:
    13
    Interesting.. So Modesthands, what information do you have, that we do not? Hmmm???? lol

    Seriously hexed, do what the others say, if you don't play wow anymore, just tell blizz you were hacked and no longer use the account, etc... etc... etc...
     
  16. hexedprojekt
    Guest

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2008
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    0
    Occupation:
    Po Po Academy
    Location:
    Newyork
    im interested in waht im not telling the truth but i can post the e-mail to u guyz they say liek i said b4 to jsut give the account back or pay the money i beleive iw as hacked but here the e-mail btw i ahvent played WoW since sept and that was on a private server havent play retail wow since about 1- 1 and half years ago. i have talked to him on teh phone he said that it does violate EULA but is not illegal? im a lil confused there


    Hi I called you

    Sorry We are not accusing you, I know for a fact you stoe back accounts and will follow through with the legal paperwork mentioned, because of your age depending on the laws in your state we may have to serve your parents and have them implicate you or take responsibility themselves

    Dave




    Quoting Ryan Goole <rgoole@yahoo.com>:

    > am i being accused of stealing my own account? or is that i still need to send in the WoW Disc?
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > ________________________________
    > From: "Dave@accounts.com" <Dave@accounts.com>
    > To: lonewolf016@yahoo.com
    > Cc: rgoole@yahoo.com
    > Sent: Thursday, December 4, 2008 2:40:53 PM
    > Subject: WOW FRAUD
    >
    > After our recent investigation of the theft of Account : aznhex016
    >
    > We bought account on Sep 16th 2008 and paid to Ryan Goole
    > lonewolf016@yahoo.com
    >
    > IP:66.67.96.211
    > Provider: Road Runner
    > Country: United States
    > State: New York
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > You agreed to relinquish ownership of it. We don't want to hear any
    > excuses from you,
    >
    > In order to resolve this issue, we ask that you return the Account
    > or return the payment.
    >
    > 1). Return Account
    >
    > OR
    >
    > 1). Return the payment 119.00 + 45.00 filing Fee to Paypal email address
    > payments@accounts.com
    >
    > If you believe this issue is not your fault, we simply ask that you contact game
    > support
    > to provide us with the reset password to the account so we can conclude this matter.
    > There should be no issues contacting game support to retrieve this password, and if
    > you are confused on how to do this, we can provide you with the appropriate information
    > to retrieve this.
    >
    > IF YOU FAIL TO RESPOND TO THIS EMAIL, HERE ARE THE ACTIONS WE WILL TAKE.
    >
    > 1). We will immediately report this account to a GM (Game Master)
    > who will disable the account permanently. Any other
    > Accounts associated to you as well will be disabled if we locate them.
    >
    > 2). We will forward the claims over to our collections agency. We previously recorded
    > your registration, billing, IP,s, and additional information through i ovation support
    > which we will provide them with (we have enough information, no additional information
    > is
    > needed) . Collections will then bill you for the following
    > - Full Retail Price - Total price of the account lost as a result of it not being
    > delivered to the customer
    > - Purchase Price - Total payment we sent you.
    > - Collections/Restocking Fee (30% Added To Total) - Total fees collections will apply
    >
    > If we are unable to recover the funds, we will file a dispute with our credit card
    > company (we have 18 months to file with our credit card) which will lock your Paypal
    > account, and prevent you from using Paypal in the future. All payments we send are done
    > by credit card so either way you're going to lose the payment we sent you but you will
    > also be billed the additional amount, and we will disable the account if need be.
    >
    > If collections feels the issues needs to be handled in court you will pay these
    > additional expenses
    > - You will have to fly out to Las Vegas to appear in court
    >
    > - Court Fees
    > - Damages done as a result of your actions
    > - Attorney Fees
    > - Additional Fees Court Requires (some cases, they may add x amount)
    > The next step will be to submit formal fraud papers to
    > you:
    >
    > We have enough to secure
    > Misdemeanor fraud charges or
    > as an accessory by receiving money for purpose of theft,but
    > the real kicker is, We will than effect future bonds you will need for certain jobs
    > especially any government job and or visa's you may attempt to acquire in the future. I
    > will
    > than send to collections and attach credit for the both of you involved.
    >
    > We are a legit American based global business, and we
    > are emailing you as a you as a courtesy to resolve the issue as it can take no more
    > than
    > 5 minutes to resolve the issue.
    >
    > If this email is ignored, it will be forwarded over to collections which once they
    > begin
    > the process, we cannot assist you any further.
    >
    > We highly suggest you email us back as soon as possible.
    > I will wait until Monday before I start the process against you at which time I will
    > submit a formal inquiry to verify your Identity for my
    > formal
    > charges.
    >
    > Best Regards,
    >
    > Dave
    > Fraud Dept.
    > 541-450-0713
     
  17. hexedprojekt
    Guest

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2008
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    0
    Occupation:
    Po Po Academy
    Location:
    Newyork
    i am prolly jsut gunna give the account back but this involves apparantly calling blizzard etc o_O i the who future govermnt jobs scares me since i will be shipping off to BASIC in less than a month, but what really irks me is just the fact that they say they know i stole my a ccount back when i didnt like wtf >.<
     
  18. Panacea
    Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2008
    Messages:
    816
    Likes Received:
    2
    Occupation:
    Marketing Assistant
    Location:
    London, United Kingdom
    Look at their Grammar and spelling mistakes, if they really was a global business they wouldn't make such errors.

    Secondly, "We will immediately report this account to a GM (Game Master), who will disable the account permanently. Any other Accounts associated to you as well will be disabled if we locate them."

    A company which goes against the WoW EULA is going to ask a GM for help regarding said in-friction of EULA, I think not.

    Now, in reference to the bold part: DID FUCKING LOL. That's a big give away into how much they're bullshitting, the only people who can trace accounts associated to you are Blizzard.

    What they are doing is called scaremongering, here is the definition; "Fear mongering (or scaremongering) is the use of fear to influence the opinions and actions of others towards some specific end."

    They are trying to scare you into believing you are in a lose:lose situation, in order to get their money or account back, however the reality of the situation is, they are in a lose:lose situation, they've lost the account and there is no way they can get their money back.

    I'll tell you why, first of all in regards to them losing the account, there are 3 possibilities;

    #1 You're lying and you actually did take the account back via sending Blizzard your cdkey, photo id, ect ect.

    #2 It wasn't your account in the first place, and whoever originally owned it did #1

    #3 Because they're a "account buying company", their IP may be flagged to Blizzard so they've locked the account and started an investigation into the account at hand.

    Now, in regards to them not getting their money back, I'm assuming you was paid via paypal, as long as 3 months has passed since they sent the payment, they can not get their money back, also neither of you signed a contract, as soon as they sent you that money, the deal was done and finished, whatever happens to that account is their fault, not yours.

    Just ignore their emails, delete them, whatever. Do not waste your time responding or worrying about it.

    Also just to put your mind at rest, the worst thing that can happen is that Paypal will lock the payment in your account, until the dispute is solved, in which case none of you will get the money due to the EULA.

    However if you've already taken the money out of your Paypal account, then you're 100% fine and in the clear.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2008
  19. Meemo
    Guest

    All my posts are made with the assumption that you are telling us all relevant information. If you are holding anything back, or are lying, my advice will not be as useful. So far I believe you to be telling the truth.

    Call Blizzard and tell them everything, including forwarding them copies of the emails you received.

    We know what the truth is. IE: We know that you had nothing to do with it.

    Give the account back, or we will close it. So I say contact Blizzard and make sure that it is closed. Then tell them that you have done so.

    How do they think they can locate accounts ?
    The data they will need to use it visible only to Blizzard. As is the ability to disable accounts.
    So they want to bill you twice for the same thing ?
    Then bill another customer for it ?
    Then bill you again.

    Contact your credit card company and Paypal now, tell them everything that is happening here. Give them copies of everything. Credit card companies do not like people screwing around with them like this.

    How much does it cost to file a lawsuit ?
    I'm pretty sure it will be more than the money they want from you.

    Tell them to file the fraud charges or shut the fuck up.

    Then tell them that you are considering filling fraud charges against them. I don't know who you should complain to about this, but you probably should.
    An accessory ?
    If they are telling the truth, you are not a mere accessory. You are the person who committed the crime.

    Again, tell them to put up or shut up.
    Wouldn't them doing this count as slander ?

    Saying that is usually a good sign that they are not. Though with some DNS lookups, I have found that their IP address places them inside the US.

    Odd choice of line break, and a capital letter in identity. Competent lawyers do not make mistakes like that.
     
  20. The Cox
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2008
    Messages:
    5,898
    Likes Received:
    13
    ^this is the best answer here. They are trying to scare you into doing something. Don't fall for it.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page